ok gang , welcome to paint application 101 with skinner .

in this write up im gonna touch base on paint applications , procedures , products and tips .

your prep work .
your prep work is the base of your finish . your finish will look no better then your surface preperation . im gonna walk you through a recent paint job i did on a jeep .

first i started by washing down my jeep body with ( T0015 ) surface prep wash . works great for removing contaminents then i follow up with a damp wet rag and allow to air dry .
next i begin my sanding work the types of paper used depends on the surface being sanded . i like to begin with (280 grit ) followed by ( 320 grit ) . now that my surface has been sanded i am ready to apply the primer coat . depending on the type of primer you are using always follow mixing instructions .

now after sanding is complete i wipe the surface down with water allow to air dry then tack the surface clean . in this application i am using a white eurathane primer coat .
after mixing i will allow the primer to set on the table while i get my gun preped for the application usually takes about 10 -15 minutes . is best to allow the primer to mix well with it components and reducer .
after suiting up i am using my binks 2001 gun for this application with my 2.0 a.k.a. 256 tip. which allows a full flow of fluid at 40 psi fed to the pot and 10 psi at the gun tip .
starting at the right fender always working from bottom up - ( never top down ) i begin my 1st pass . working my way down the drivers side of the jeep and finishing at the hood .
now my hand stays between 13-16 inches off the surface at all times with my fan spread set at 3" at the tip with a full 10 -12inch spread .which allows me to cover more area at 1 time .
after allowing a 15 minute flash in between coats i come back and apply my 2nd finish coat . at this point i increase the fluid flow just a touch and lower my air pressue to the pot by 10psi .
because i want a heavier coat at this point so i move my hand closer to the surface by 4 inches . following steps above i work from bottom to top and finishing up on hood .
next . after allowing primer to cure fully i begin the final sand work by wet sanding the primer coat at this point with 400 wet dry paper
(Tip:) wet sanding your primer coat by hand will always produce a smoother finish then dry sanding and doesnt really take that much effort . also while your sanding your actually cleaning the surface at the same time .
now -- my jeep is primed , wet sanded and washed down, recovered and ready for the finish .
im gonna be using a base-coat clear coat finish on my rig .
following the same mixing procedure as the primer coat i allow the paint to set on the table after i mix it for the 10-15 minutes .
now im ready to paint . i do 1 final pass of cleaning , i use the T115 again and wipe the surface down followed by a wet rag and dry rag
(Tip:) always follow up with a dry rag at this point to eliminate any rags mark .
now i do 1 final tack rag pass and im ready to go .
( tip i have changed my gun tip nozzle to 1.7 tip a.k.a.165 tip
starting at the drivers side front fender i begin with the top to bottom passes moving down the side of the jeep following the coutours of the body i apply my 1st pass of top coat . now since this type of paint requires clear to make it glossy it goes on flat so i layer it on in passes like mowing the lawn .
once i have applied my base i allow to flash 15 minutes between coats and the last coat i allow to flash a full half hour .
now on to the clear finish .
( tip:) with clear top coats you can add things like metal flakes and effects if you wish to enhance your finish . but to spray metal flake you will have to use a larger tip and higher air pressure . to do my standard clear application i am using my 1.7mm tip on the gun
following the same pattern i painted i apply the clear starting from top to bottom i follow through with the clear in an even pattern not trying to cover so much at 1 time . clear should be applied in 3 coats aprox. 2 mils thick at higher air psi then paint i like about 15-20 psi at the gun tip at this point and 45-60 psi at the gun feed note:im using a pressure pot ......and while applying the clear i keep my hand off the surface atleast 13 inches at all times .
( tip:) while paint and clear applications some painters like the crisscross method which works great for full even coverage but this method should be left to the pros
because it is very easy to over load and run the clear .....( hence the feel i spoke about on the other tread . )
some issues you may encounter when applying clear are as follows :
clear to dry ...Cause :your hand is to far away solution : adjust your air flow lower raise your fluid out put and move a bit closer and slow down some .
clear has orange peel effect .( very common )...cause : you are applying the clear to heavy and your air is to low solution : adjust your air higher and lower your fluid out put .
now my job is complete and i allow clear to cure fully over night .

now some more tips .
a. you can never clean your surface to much ( more is better )
b. never lean into your job per-say back off a bit move that hand back .
c. never-ever try to cover in the first coat you will run the paint every time .
d.( lacquer -thinner ) is NOT a surface cleaner !!! it is exactly what the name implies it is a paint thinner and wiping your paint with it thinking you are cleaning ,you are really weakining your base .
e. resperators are your friends USE THEM .
f. do not get impatient !! take your time . time is good
most people on the tread will probably never experience the industrial use products i have used as a painter and detailer of 20 + years and i have used so many different products and tips etc .. it is impossible to address them all here
so i hope the above walk through so to speak helps out a bit ..................and i am open to feild any questions you may have or would like me to address about your paint projects .
i am also very exp in body repairs so i can feild questions about products and tips there also .

will this technique work for solids and metallics, gun and tip?

well for me i like to change my tips for the prefered application of each product . smaller tip for finer material applications and larger tips for epoxy primers high builds etc.
now with metallics and clear that is a larger tip application due to the metal flake . air higher air pressure the problem many people will face with metallics ic ( you ) have ZERO control of the flake itself just the clear its best that the applicator keep an even wet coat and let the flake flow properly.

using a smaller tip for metallic applications will cause clogging .

When using base/clear do you want to try to cover with the color just like you would if you were not using a clear? Or just cover enough to have even color? With hardened enamel you would apply at least one more coat after complete, even coverage correct? What about color sanding between the base and the clear? Bad idea or good idea?

the base coat is very tricky because it is not glossy and fools many people because they are tricked into beleiving that since its flat looking its not enough
when applying base coat you want to lay it on in even coats but make sure you do get proper coverage because you will see light spots when you apply the clear dont try to pound it on take your time and keep 12-15 inches off the surface .

you do not sand the base coat before the application of the clear .it is already formulated to accept the clear .so yes ( Bad idea )

Thanks for clearing that up. Otherwise I would have made a pretty expensive error. I am planning some basic stripes on my truck and thought about color sanding where the different colors meet to make it smooth. Now I know not to do that. I do know to paint the top first, then the next down, etc so as to minimize the ridge. Here's a crude MS Paint of what I want the truck to look like. Sort of.


So I would paint the entire truck white, then mask and paint the red, then mask and paint the black correct?

here is a stripe prep tip for ya :

when laying out your stripe use 3m scotch fine line tape its on a roll and it leaves a very fine line .

I have two comments.

1) Watch your spray suit and hoses when you lean in to paint the middle parts of the vehicle. Many a paint job has been ruined by dragging the hose or letting your saggy, baggy shoot suit get into the wet paint.

2) "Lacquer Thinner" isn't. Any reducer good enough to thin real lacquer generally says so on the can and is very expensive. Generic lacquer thinner usually costs under ten dollars a gallon, is full of water and recycled solvents, and isn't good for anything other than cleaning equipment after use. Keep it around for flushing out your pressure pots, hoses, and guns, but please don't ever wipe down a vehicle with a lacquer thinner-soaked rag and tell me it's clean enough to paint. I know you touched on this, but I just wanted to make it clearer.

this is so very very true , i have seen a few people on the tread mention they wiped down with lacquer thinner this is a #1 lacquer thinner is for nothing more then paint thinning use and clean up after period . so dont do it .

the first time i experienced lacquer thinner years and years ago when i was 14 the stuff was so pure it would burn the flesh off ya pure thinner no additives .

as for hoses and stuff ....i use the over the shoulder down the body method most painters do and hold the feed line behind the body with the free hand while leaning in and over your paint project .

You'd be amazed at how many painters don't know to hold the hoses over their shoulder and with their other hand.

What needs to be done to a chrome bumper to prep it for paint? I hate chrome.

lol toss it in the garbage and buy another 1 , there is not a paint product on the market today that will adhere to chrome . you might find something for the short term but it will peel count on that .

reason : true chrome is a non abrasive ,non pouris surface .

sandblast the chrome off...paint it.

-dave

yeah that can be done but the down side to that process is if you dont have a serious blaster it aint worth the aggravation . usually chrome plating is a good 3-5 mils thick beleive me you will tire of that blasting buissness real fast .

sure if its a real killer bumper or something worth holding onto and puttin the time into ..if not trade it ,pitch it ,and get another .

?-To clean the vehicle what would be the best thing to use w/out spending 1k to do it

I would like to clean the 8 so I can shoot it (see the build in the vintage forum, I sanded it and need to re-sand) this week w/the red oxide. It's been a looooooooonnnng time since I painted. I need to pick up some fish eye as well. I know I have to tack it off b-4 I shoot or was that in the old days.

Thanks,

Link to post 107
http://jeeptalk.net/index.php?showtopic=44...mp;#entry115822

I'm calling the U-Pol company tomorrow for their tintable raptor bed-liner spray. Hopefully I can use the Gillespie OD to tint, I'm gonna ask.

there are to products i would recommend for your procedure .

1. denatured alcohol = so so

2. T115 prep- solvent = excellent

Where would one get the T115?

1 lives in Citrus county for now.

P.S. After I prime the whole vehicle I should WET sand it correct. Been a long time.

P.S.S. How many OZ of reducer to a Qt or should I look on the label

1. let me find out where you can get it in your area .

2. yes if you wet sand the primer with 400 W/D it will give you a nicer finish .

3. always follow your label instructions .only experienced painters should mix paint by eye .

experienced? you must first do it to get experience.

skinner i camouflaged one of the toys recently. i have in the past used rattle can clear to coat over the camo. works good for about 1-2 years then the clear wears away. is there a safe clear to put over spray paint? something that lasts but isnt too hot.

I have some 320 grit I use to use. B-4 I got hitched 24 yrs ago I painted 5 cars and my CJ5, but the ole memory isn't what it use to be I usually did it by eye and just added a cap full of fish-eye per Qt sprayed.

if you are using an enamel base paint ....basic imron all-purpose clear can be used as a good seleant .

what you can also do is spray a test panel and see what works best with certain paints . i do know imron clear will burn and bubble certain lacquer finishes also there are a few all - purpose automotive clears that can be used .

some times we use tranny fluid as a fish - eye prevenative .

Seems like it would put an oil slick in the finish.

Here is what I will be using. I was going to go w/Dave's paint but can't spend the $ right now. Looking for work.

I recieved this from Midwest Military in '06

It's Gelespie paint 23070 OD

i myself like to use marine style chaulking such as 101 flexable UV sealents and for awesome bonding power 5200 .

you would be surprised how great marine style products perform on jeeps due to the high abuse levels .

that por 15 is just like rust-lock just alittle thinner

It's straight Enamel Semi-gloss 595-23070-11LFD OD

OK, it doesn't say how much to reduce it so I will type out the label.

1. How much should I reduce per quart? I'll reduce it right in the gun. (one qt for how many oz of reducer & fish-eye). I use to just use a cap full of fish-eye & call it even The label doesn't say or i cant read it's terminology.

Below is the label off the OD, it is the same info for the Red Oxide.
For FULL view go here if U can't read it---> http://www.street2mud.com/gallery/CJ8/100_1944?full=1

i would reduce that 4 to 1 so that = out to every 4 oz. reduce 1oz . then spray a test shot if it sprays alittle heavy add another 1 oz. of reducer .

is that already a premix enamel or is it 3 part ....paint ...catalyst ....reducer .

sir a word of advice while using XYLENE . use caution with this product in some instances we in the paint industry try to stay away from that item its bad news .

OK



I have no Idea. The label doesn't say or I'm a moe-ron



Elaborate, venting?

I was in Tractor Supply the other day and noticed they have acrylic enamel tractor paint and hardener. Stuff is cheap too. $29.95/gallon, hardener is $14.95 I think. Anybody ever use the stuff? It's really tempting to buy a gallon and give it a try because that's less than half what you pay for paint at the paint shop. Color selection is limited of course.

be aware that acrylic enamel is like the wifes nail polish . just with a hardening agent . and requires quit a bit of care to maintain.

now on my YJ i have acrylic enamel ...but there is a BIG difference . the paint i used is $108 a gal. and is high grade refined Marine acrylic and is formulated to withstand the abuses i inflict on it ..

in corbett kevin was pepperin my jeep with pebbles kickin up rocks bouncin off my hood ...trees scraping down the sides on trails and not 1 rock or tree branch left a mark .

you get what you pay for . keep that in mind

Rollbar :

do yourself a big favor that XYLENE is poison make sure you use a good resperator and get away to fresh air as soon as your done just a deep wiff of that garbage will damage the layers on your lungs like freeze dry .

that stuff is like the old imron mix they had back in the early 80's that they took off the market because it was killing painters . imron was actually discontinued for 4 years becasue of that issue and the use of lacquer base came on the scene .

i have been a professional auto and boat painter for over 20 yrs. and you couldnt get me to touch that stuff . not trying to discourage you just given you an experienced point of view .

What would U use different looking @ the label?

in this heat ....most likely T001 tropical reducer .

if ya didnt live so far away i'd hook ya up with the goodies ya need .

in to weeks i have the oppertunity to paint a 02'jeep TJ including some body repairs and priming etc .if the guy accepts my bid i paint his jeep and he gets me new set Dick Cepek Tires for my Y/J

so if i get this job i will snap some pics to post so all can see it being done step by step .

Excellent. I am going to order the U-POL Raptor spray bedliner and that will be here net week as well. I'm gonna spray the bed then I will shoot the outside/fenders/hood.

Bought some U-POL spray in bed liner for the conversion. Picked it up this morning and the guy sells POR-15 cheap. 25 bucks a pint and 35 (I think) for a quart.


Question, should I install the bulk head first and then spray to help w/the seal (even though I will use some seam sealer) and look of the finish since it will be sprayed?

yeah go ahead and get it all in ...remember some sanding should be done before application of that product as well as a good surface cleaning ......i wanna do that in the Y/J ....

here is a suggestion you may follow it if you wish or not its entirely up to you .

with that type of spray gun applicator you dont have an adjustable tip on it which is gonna give you a straight on splatter in a restricted area .....what i would do it i would tap the tip with a hammer just a touch to give it just a slight longated shape so you will have alittle more of a spray pattern and less restriction because see thats not actually a spray gun per say its for splatter applications only ..

Thanks, the guy said he sprays @ 50psi but I can very it for the texture needed. I think I will take your advise cause I can do pretty well w/a spray gun and can & I am use to seeing a fan pattern. W/out the fan pattern it might screw me up. BUT, if I fan it do you think it would cause a drip?

My son and I are going to go over the Jeep on Monday and use the POR-15 metal etch as well for the best adhesion. Hopefully we will spray on Tuesday morning if not Monday afternoon, depends how jumpy I get

I think I have talked myself out of going the base/clear route. But if I want to do a multi color paint job how long do I have to wait with hardened enamel before I can tape and spray the other color? A day, week, month? I may just go with a single color, but you never know about me.

if you dont mind my honest exp. opinion....that metal etc stuff is crap and a waste of your $$$ there is absolutly nothing in chemical form ...well other then boric acid that will etch metal .

No surfacing product paint and or otherwise will give you its best bond performance if it doesnt have anything to bond to . Suggestion : at least get scotch brite pads pref the green ones ...and get in there and put the time in and scuff up the surface if its paint your goin over if its raw metal use 80/100 grit .

you will be more satisfied and content knowing you did it correctly .

I really appreciate your honesty and knowledge. I did sand the tub but want to go over it again w/ the scotch pad. Then rub it down w/De-Natured alcohol IF NEEDED, if not just soap/H20.

What U think?

i would give it at least 48 hrs. for enamel then uses low tack tape as a line base then for a really fine line use scothch tape as your lead line .


that sounds ok

?-is rubbing alcohol the same as De-Natured. I think so but can't remember. wally world sells it cheap.

no it isnt rubbing alcohol is for human use .....denatured alcohol isnt . if you use standard rubbing alcohol in there not only will you be creating a flammable situation
but i will leave a residue all over everything .

Wow, thanks very much.

so i just got the word this morn that the capt . has accepted my bid to paint his jeep so i get new tire $$$ ,for the Y/J while i am doing this job over the up coming weekend i will take some pics of the steps during the job . body repairs , prep and paint .

Ok, the Raptor bed-liner is in. Go HERE to see the results

Tub complete


OD color contrast on how it will look when completed

so moving right along here are a few pics of the jeep im painting this weekend .....and new tires for me out of the deal

its an 02; T/J paint code PS5 silver few dents and dings nothing to major ,



nasty lil dent




hood is seriously faded


here is the factory paint product the capt. wants us to use .


the mixing ratio on this product is 8-1-2 .

im am starting prep on this job friday night and will have the rig painted and ready for delivery by sunday afternoon .

its a weekend worth of work but its a pretty easy way to earn a new set of tires .

spending the last 18 years painting large mass yacht hulls 100 + feet in size a lil jeep like this is a walk in the park .

that came out pretty good rollbar did ya do alittle hammer tap action on that gun tip or no ? i think i wanna do the inside of the Y/J like that and do away with the carpet .